Focusing on solving problems not changing page elements

Talia Wolf

A Conversation with Getuplift’s Talia Wolf about Experimentation

With so many metrics and stats, CRO can quickly become a cold numbers game — but behind these numbers are the often forgotten people who have real needs and motivations. I recently spoke to Talia about her Emotional Targeting methodology to optimization which focuses on addressing solving customer problems rather than merely tinkering with elements on a page.


Rommil: Could tell us a bit about yourself, and what motivated you to found Getuplift?

Talia: I started my marketing journey in a social media marketing agency, working on Facebook, YouTube, Twitter and Linkedin campaigns.

I worked with many brands on creating communities for them, igniting engagement and driving traffic to their site.

Our goal was always traffic to site or engagement on social platforms, but as I ran more campaigns, the more I wanted to know more. I wanted to know what kind of impact the traffic had on the site in terms of leads, sales and revenue. To get better results, I changed things. Little things; call to action buttons, headlines, sometimes even an image. I did all of this based on blog posts I read or a case study I found. At some point, I found that this is what I loved doing.

Long after leaving the agency and working with a startup company as the marketing manager, I still had a passion for optimization. That’s when my two business partners approached me to say they were starting a conversion optimization agency and wanted me to join. That was when I learned that what I had been doing all those years, was CRO.

We developed the Emotional Targeting methodology. A framework used to identify people’s intent and dig into the different emotional triggers that persuade their decision-making process. Using this method we understand the content, design and experience people have to go through within a customer journey in order to convert (and become life lasting customers or clients).

After 5 years running the agency, we sold it and I started my own consultancy business.

Based on our Emotional Targeting methodology, GetUplift provides conversion optimization services for high-growth companies using customer-centric methods and data-driven analysis.

These days we also have courses, webinars and workshops that teach marketers, founders and entrepreneurs how to use our methodology to increase conversions and grow the business.

Love it. I feel that consumer behaviour and psychology are far too overlooked in CRO these days. It’s like everyone has blinders on and only stares at the metrics without thinking about user’s motivations. It’s like marketers have forgotten how to actually market I’d love to hear more about your Emotional Targeting methodology. Could you give us a high-level overview of what that is?

As I mentioned, when I started out I was making changes to different elements on the page (e.g the call to action button), but these actions weren’t getting the results we needed for our clients. We needed to go deeper. By understanding how people make decisions, what motivates people’s actions and WHY they buy products (or ask for a demo for example), we were able to take conversion optimization to the next level. It’s not about changing elements on the page, it’s about solving problems. Identifying the prospect’s real problem and solving it for them on the page, giving them the information they need (and the product), to convert. Once we understand what people need to see on the page to convert, what emotional triggers they have and how they make decisions, it’s easier to write high-converting copy, choose the right visuals and create entire funnels from scratch that we can test on a strategic level. These types of tests drive real results, results that last.

Check it out here: https://getuplift.co/cro-training/

Changing gears. Considering the current situation, how has the epidemic affected your business? Are there any trends that you’ve noticed?

At first, things shifted a lot. We felt a surge in people enrolling in classes, and some of our potential client contracts were postponed. However, the need to grow your online business and increase your revenue online has never been greater so things weren’t back to normal pretty quickly.

Happy to hear that!

Speaking of clients, when you audit a new client — what are the key things you look for and how do they influence your decision on where to start Experimenting?

Our audit is divided into two main parts: Qualitative and Quantitative.

During the quantitative research, we analyze people’s behaviour across the whole funnel. Using tools such as Google Analytics, heatmaps, user testing and others to identify how people interact with the funnel, locate the different leaks in the funnel and the opportunities for optimization.

During the qualitative analysis, we focus on identifying who the prospect really is, beyond their geographical location, gender, age or job. We analyze surveys, conduct interviews, analyze conversations with the sales team, the customer success team, review chat transcripts and run in-depth customer research beyond the client’s customer base to better understand the prospect’s real intent, their concerns, hesitations and desired outcomes.

Using all this information we map out a roadmap for optimization, what needs to be optimized and when for the best results.


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Having worked with a wide variety of clients — could you share with us the major differences between B2B and B2C companies in terms of Experimentation?

The difference that usually stands out the most between how much you can actually test. Many B2B funnels do not have the amount of conversions per month they need in order to run a meaningful test and reach results quickly which means that depending on the research, the client, the industry and our goals, some of the suggestions would be implemented and analyzed over time, and only the big hypotheses and changes would be tested.

The way people make decisions, however, doesn’t change. That is why the impact on some B2B businesses is greater than to B2C companies.

“It’s not about changing elements on the page, it’s about solving problems.”

Could you tell us about your favourite Experiment?

I don’t exactly have a favourite test but I recently did some work for Social Media Examiner and loved working on the different variations for the sales page and their content upgrades. On one occasion we were able to increase conference ticket sales by over 15%.

We also did some great work with an agency not long ago where we wrote an entire email sequence for them to test along with a few landing pages and that was fun too 🙂

You’re quite active on the speaking circuit — where can our readers catch you next?

Due to COVID I’m doing a LOT of online conferences and I’m really enjoying it. I have a few webinars coming up for Conversionista, The Growth Summit and others.

Very cool! I’m sure some of our readers would love to catch your sessions.

Finally, it’s time for the Lightning Round!

Bayesian or Frequentist?

Frequentist.

What is your favourite Experimentation tool?

I work with what our clients use 🙂 but lately, it has been Google Optimize surprisingly.

Describe Talia in 5 words or less.

Passionate. Always learning. Never quits

Talia, thank you for joining the conversation!




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